[Azure]

I was checking out Etch's Sonic R stats, and besides the few tag and balloon stats, he beats every record by seconds. This in itself is not suspicious, but I believe he just came here a little while ago. 
If you look at the Sonic R videos, none of them are by him.
So what I'm saying is, he attained 37 records and 1 championship, in a very small amount of time, with no proof posted here.

That is all.

[Groudon]

That game is so broken, nobody's even trying to get anywhere close to his stats anymore.

All levels have some type of glitch you can use to get ridiculous times.

[P.P.A.]

AND MIKE REFUSES TO FIX IT
SPLIT THE CHARTS OR BAN THE GLITCHES, AND RESTORE THE FUN AND LOVE OF THIS GLORIOUS GAME

[Groudon]

It's not happening.  Get over it.

* Groudon run

[Etch]

It's because I am so awesome like that.

Those remaining balloon and tag times annoy me so.

I was browsing youtube for various glitches and noticed some people could get out of bounds on RI.  Using a little logic, I decided to test if this game has checkpoints or not.  In any time trials game this is very important because if you can exploit it, it means you can do quick shortcut laps.  As expected, this game makes no attempt to place checkpoints in except for below RE which means no super fast flaps.  My main motivation came from Kmacc and previously sdj being higher up the charts so what better to beat them by finding some shortcuts, lolz.

Since shortcut times were already allowed on RC I wanted to push the envelope and see how much can really be done.  This is time trials, we want to get the fastest times possible.  Very quickly, Kmacc and I found a way to shortcut every other level by just going out of bounds and looping around the finish line.  Amy was the key with super sonic being used on just some flaps, RR and RE times.  Some break throughs are very rare and it takes a long time to get some of them.  Other ones can be done with some consistency when you get the technique down.  The most powerful is just driving through a wall as opposed to boosting into it with Amy or bouncing off of it and then going through like with super sonic.  As you can imagine going 3/3 on some of these can be challenging but if you are pwnsome enough and have enough skillz you can do them too.

I had some stuff posted before but I detest youtube.

Some examples

RC: http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=batch_download&batch_id=Q01GcHBNTkxOMUEwTVE9PQ
RI: http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=batch_download&batch_id=Q01GcHBDOC9kMnMwTVE9PQ
RR: http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=batch_download&batch_id=Q01GcHBBNDRtUUUwTVE9PQ
RF: http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=batch_download&batch_id=Q01GcHBIQzNCSWRjR0E9PQ
RE: http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=batch_download&batch_id=Q01GcHBMTEQ3bUJjR0E9PQ
old scroll: http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=batch_download&batch_id=Q01GcHBMTERFc0kwTVE9PQ

Good day sir!!!

[Kmacc]

This topic made me lol. Etch is legit, I know for a fact. he has vids, he knows what he's doing, etc.

As much as I hate these stupid shortcuts, what he did with them is amazing. Nobody is close because not many play the game to begin with, and with shortcuts it took a lot of interest away from those who did. I'm one of the few that even tried them, although I'm not very good at them anyway, besides from the fact that I hate them.

If more people tried, the charts would be closer together, we just need more players.

[Azure]

Ok. I am convinced. Just wish they'd ban those glitches because I'm not even going to attempt them.

[Stefan]

Does anyone here have a coherent argument to ban the glitches? Is this just a few 'not-fun' complaints unsubstantiated by anything except other opinions?

[Bilan]

Correct!

Its just a few people mumbling thats its "not fun" without another real reason to ban breaking OOB

[P.P.A.]

- Because of the glitches nobody's playing Sonic R anymore, competition in it is basically dead.
- The OOB glitches affect each and every course. They aren't just a small problem for a level one has to bear with, no, they change the way the entire game is played, separating it from its basic gameplay and destroying everything that was its essence, everything that was the game.

See this thread http://www.soniccenter.org/forum/index.php?topic=3228.0 for old discussions and arguments.

[Groudon]

- Because of the glitches nobody's playing Sonic R anymore, competition in it is basically dead.

So why don't we take down Sonic06 charts?  Sonic06 has tons of level-related glitches within itself (and some character glitches) that halted competition for a long time.

[Stefan]

a.) Sonic R wasn't exactly 'hopping' to begin with.
b.) did the SDJ, Kmacc, Etch glitchfest not count as competition? Wasn't that all at the record level?
c.) The game is not changed. the top strategies require glitches. So do sonic 1's. The game is the game, and you can choose to compete how you wish. If that requires OOB, then it does.

Not to mention, this argument still boils down to 'It's not fun'.

[Parax]

So why don't we take down Sonic06 charts?  Sonic06 has tons of level-related glitches within itself (and some character glitches) that halted competition for a long time.

Sonic 06's glitches don't let you go straight to the end of every single level.

[Stefan]

Sonic 1's often do!

[Groudon]

So why don't we take down Sonic06 charts?  Sonic06 has tons of level-related glitches within itself (and some character glitches) that halted competition for a long time.

Sonic 06's glitches don't let you go straight to the end of every single level.

If you want to be technical, neither does Sonic R.  One level doesn't take advantage of this type of glitch like the other 4.

[fastnaturedude]

If we end up continuing the voting from that topic, I vote for Freestyle charts.

[Azure]

Freestyle? Good idea.

Someone please try to have this idea mentioned to a site admin.

[Groudon]

The idea was brought up before, but IIRC it was shot down.

[fastnaturedude]

Well I'm reviving it :(

[Stefan]

Ok? Well, then, when I have time, I will give it another thorough shooting down.

[Bilan]

Its been shot down enough times that you needn't bother Stef :(

To those campaigning for ban/freestyle, well, look. Its not happening. Sorry if your game isnt fun to play at top tier competition level anymore, but either go do those glitches an continue competing at top tier level, or dont, and compete with the rest of the people on the charts.

I dont really care either way but please quit whining about it, the committee has more important things to discuss than Sonic R. Again.

[Etch]

Most of the times on the charts suck ass anyways.  You should be able to get 2'05-2'07 on RE rev 3lap without falling out of bounds.  Nearest players are at 2'18 here, lol.

If you actually use super sonic and try sliding more you can easily rape the charts to #3 without exploiting any of the checkpoints.  Just being able to rank high without much effort should be motivation enough to play since it helps on overall charts here if you are into that sort of thing.  While non-sc racing may have it's charm, when you start going as fast as possible you realize falling through walls is not all that rare and makes finishing 3/3 laps a little hard on some places.  This thing has been beaten to a pulp so not much more to say.

I didn't realize DarkspinesSonic had such a good time on RI rev 3lap!

I nearly killed myself on that course to attain perfection, haha.

[Kmacc]

^I would do that, but I'm already #2. =D

I know the charts won't get changed so there's no reason fighting it. Maybe we need some charts elsewhere? o_O

[P.P.A.]

Looks like we just have to compete in a boring forum thread here. :(

[Azure]

I know, I'll start a boycott. No more competing in Sonic R until the glitches get a BANNNNN.

...who's with me?

[douglas]

I know, I'll start a boycott. No more competing in Sonic R until the glitches get a BANNNNN.

...who's with me?

Everyone but those benefiting, I'd imagine.  Look, we can't ban things because people don't like them - it's too subjective and where would you stop?  You have to demonstrate that the use of the offending strat/glitch/whatever removes the possibility of skillful competition.  I don't like score scalping in adv2, but there's still valid competition, so it stands.

Live with it.

[P.P.A.]

Before, Sonic R had SOME competition. Small rivalries between me and bertin, and generally a couple of submissions from a few people over the week. Now, it's absolutely dead. Nobody plays it anymore.

[Magnezone]

Unless they want free sitepoints.

[Aitamen]

Regardless of how 'broken" a game gets, nothing gets banned until it completely annihilates the competitive aspect of the game...

in R, it's about the glitches, yes, but the execution of them is based on skill...

not like the TBG, which was banned because it made all of Team Dark into "button mash, button mash, move a little, rinse, get a soda, repeat*

so I am pro this game staying where it is... if you have dedicated that much time to mastery of this game, then you deserve it...

just like Thorn's most recent hack, where my skill comes from manipulation of game mechanics and small glitches along the way...

[Stefan]

DAMNIT.

PPA, azure, correct me if I'm wrong, but you did not have high record counts in SR, did you?

If not, why the hell do the glitches matter? In almost all of the levels, you can still get second place without executing a single oob glitch. The lack of competition in this game is not due to glitches depriving the game of its meaning, it's your stubborn refusal to deal with the development of new strategies.

If you want to time attack SR normally still, then do it. There is nobody stopping you. The charts are not even full of glitched times. The glitches only make a dent at the record level. You can still get high red stats, even second place, without the execution of the taboo manuevers.

Either quit competing, silently, or deal with the glitches. Your boycott means nothing. You can still compete at a high level in the game if you're willing to actually complete rather than whine about someone's effort at getting records.

bah